A deconverted christian's commentary on a plain reading of the Bible and how it contrasts with the reality of history, science, and every day life.
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Showing posts with label martyrs. Show all posts
Showing posts with label martyrs. Show all posts
Thursday, August 15, 2019
Ignatius's letter to the Ephesians part two.
After reading the Wikipedia article on Ignatius and reading some of his letter to the Ephesians, I have a lot of questions about how anyone could know if he was real or fiction. As far as I know there are no originals of Ignatius's letters. He would have been writing on or about the first century mark, if his letters are genuine. Why was he imprisoned? We are not told. Yet it can't have been just for being a a Christian or preaching christianity, because others were doing that freely. He was even supposedly permitted to fraternize with christians while he was in chains. Why was he being taken to Rome? The authorities could have dealt with him right where he lived. Why did he expect to be martyred? That early on, martyrdom didn't necessarily mean death.
We are now at the 8th chapter of Ignatius's letter. Let's see what else he has to say. Ignatius appears to be buttering up the Ephesians , telling them they are living according to god's will, being faithful, spiritual, and doing all things in Jesus. They don't listen to false teachers, no siree. They are the cream of the crop, the tippety top, when it comes to loving god and obeying the commandments of Jesus. We aren't told what those commandments are.
The Ephesians are to pray for the poor deluded souls who are not followers of the lord. They are to be meek and humble in the face of insults, boasting, and cruelties. After all, no people are more unjustly treated than the followers of the lord. The Ephesians are to stay holy and not let the devil plant any false ideas in their minds.
Next, the author says they are in the "last times." Sound familiar? It's been the last times for a long time. In spite of the fact that Ignatius thinks the Ephesians are already the greatest, he feels it is necessary to tell them how to live, as if they didn't know. They must do one of two things: "Either stand in awe of of the wrath to come or or show regard for the grace which is at present displayed." When the end comes, he wants to be on the same team as the Ephesians.
Ignatius is a condemned man, but the Ephesians live in safety and appear to be a refuge for refugees of the gospel. They were mentioned by Paul "in all his epistles." (That isn't actually true.) They were initiated into the mysteries of the gospel with "Paul, the holy, the martyred, the deservedly most happy." Ignatius wants to find himself at the feet of Paul when he dies. At the writing of this letter, Paul should not have been dead more than about 50 years, yet he is being venerated as something of a saint.
The Ephesians are to meet regularly in the same place. That destroys the power of Satan. (Wouldn't they have already been doing that?) None of the things in this letter are hid from them if they perfectly possess faith and love. (If these things are not hidden and the Ephesians are as wonderful as Ignatius says, why does he need to tell them all this stuff. Isn't he preaching to the choir?) A person who makes a declaration of faith does not sin. A person who loves does not hate. How the Ephesians behave matters, not just "mere profession." They must be faithful to the end. I hope they had good lives, in spite of never getting to see the end they were hoping for.
More next time.
Thursday, January 24, 2019
Mark part fourteen
We are now at Mark 8:14. After Jesus has told the Pharisees that he won't give them a sign from heaven, he and the disciples get in the ever present boat and cross the lake again. The disciples forgot about bringing food and had only one loaf of bread. To which Jesus says, "Beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and that of Herod." Since we have just encountered Pharisees looking for a sign, I'm assuming Jesus is chiding them for not trusting him to provide for them, which he sees as the influence of the Pharisees. This is further born out in his discussion of the feeding of the five thousand and the four thousand, after which he says, "Do you still not understand?" It seems that the disciples had not seen those events as miraculous, and they were there.
Next they were in Bethsaida. Jesus healed a blind man with his spit, but for some reason it took two tries. Not only that, Jesus took the man out of the village to heal him, and after he was healed, he told him not to go back to the village. Doesn't that sound odd? Years later, if anyone asked the people of Bethsaida if Jesus had healed anyone there, they would say no. Then a follower could say that's because it happened outside the village.
Next Jesus and the disciples went to the villages "around" Caesarea Philippi. (No specifics to pin anything down.) On the way there, Jesus went fishing, metaphorically speaking. He asked the disciples what people thought of him. They replied that some people thought he was (the resurrected) John the Baptist. Others thought he was Elijah or one of the other old testament prophets. Then Jesus asked the disciples who they thought he was. Peter said he was the Christ. Note that this does not mean Peter thought Jesus was a literal son of god, but rather the "anointed one" or ruler/leader/messiah that the Jews had come to expect from their interpretation of their scriptures. Of course, Jesus warned his disciples not to tell anyone about him. Makes you wonder how the author was able to find any sources for this book. Plus, Jesus didn't actually tell Peter that he was correct.
Next, Jesus told the disciples that "the son of man" must suffer many things, be rejected by all the important Jews, be killed, and rise again after three days. Presumably he was referring to himself. Peter thought so and took Jesus aside to rebuke him for saying those things. Jesus then Said, "Get behind me, Satan." Which is not a very nice thing to say to someone who is concerned for your welfare.
Then Jesus tells everyone around him that if they want to follow him, they have to deny themselves and take up their cross. This would have made no sense to people who had no idea what a cross would eventually mean to christians, unless they understood it as a call to willing martyrdom. Then Jesus says, "Whoever wants to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for me and for the gospel will save it." This seems to be a clear call for voluntary martyrdom. Not only that, it elevates those who choose that path, which is sick. What is this gospel Jesus wants people to die for? So far, the book of Mark (1:14,15) has only told us that the gospel/good news is the message that the kingdom of god is near. That's it.
After encouraging people to die for him and his message, Jesus asks the crowd, "What good is it for a man to gain the whole world , yet forfeit his soul?" The implication is that if a person is on team Jesus, team die-for-the-gospel, they get to keep their soul forever. If they are not, sure they might have a long, happy life, full of good things. But when it's all over, bam!, bye bye soul. And this is supposed to be a reason to give up everything for Jesus. The crowd is also told that if anyone is ashamed of him and his words (He's looking at you, Peter), then the son of man will be ashamed of that person "when he comes in his father's glory with the holy angels." I find it hard to believe that anyone in that day and age could get away with saying something like that in public and not get stoned.
Last, Jesus says that some of those standing there would not taste death before they see the kingdom of god come. Well. They are all dead now, so what is the kingdom of god? Is it the one we read about in Revelation, the one up in the sky that comes down and settles on earth? That hasn't happened yet. It can't be it, can it? The churches of Christ say that the earthly church (true christians) is the kingdom that Jesus was talking about. However, it seems to me that this is a reference to that time when Jesus is supposed to come back in his father's glory. That kingdom was what was supposed to be near. In that case, Jesus was a liar or a lunatic.
Next they were in Bethsaida. Jesus healed a blind man with his spit, but for some reason it took two tries. Not only that, Jesus took the man out of the village to heal him, and after he was healed, he told him not to go back to the village. Doesn't that sound odd? Years later, if anyone asked the people of Bethsaida if Jesus had healed anyone there, they would say no. Then a follower could say that's because it happened outside the village.
Next Jesus and the disciples went to the villages "around" Caesarea Philippi. (No specifics to pin anything down.) On the way there, Jesus went fishing, metaphorically speaking. He asked the disciples what people thought of him. They replied that some people thought he was (the resurrected) John the Baptist. Others thought he was Elijah or one of the other old testament prophets. Then Jesus asked the disciples who they thought he was. Peter said he was the Christ. Note that this does not mean Peter thought Jesus was a literal son of god, but rather the "anointed one" or ruler/leader/messiah that the Jews had come to expect from their interpretation of their scriptures. Of course, Jesus warned his disciples not to tell anyone about him. Makes you wonder how the author was able to find any sources for this book. Plus, Jesus didn't actually tell Peter that he was correct.
Next, Jesus told the disciples that "the son of man" must suffer many things, be rejected by all the important Jews, be killed, and rise again after three days. Presumably he was referring to himself. Peter thought so and took Jesus aside to rebuke him for saying those things. Jesus then Said, "Get behind me, Satan." Which is not a very nice thing to say to someone who is concerned for your welfare.
Then Jesus tells everyone around him that if they want to follow him, they have to deny themselves and take up their cross. This would have made no sense to people who had no idea what a cross would eventually mean to christians, unless they understood it as a call to willing martyrdom. Then Jesus says, "Whoever wants to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for me and for the gospel will save it." This seems to be a clear call for voluntary martyrdom. Not only that, it elevates those who choose that path, which is sick. What is this gospel Jesus wants people to die for? So far, the book of Mark (1:14,15) has only told us that the gospel/good news is the message that the kingdom of god is near. That's it.
After encouraging people to die for him and his message, Jesus asks the crowd, "What good is it for a man to gain the whole world , yet forfeit his soul?" The implication is that if a person is on team Jesus, team die-for-the-gospel, they get to keep their soul forever. If they are not, sure they might have a long, happy life, full of good things. But when it's all over, bam!, bye bye soul. And this is supposed to be a reason to give up everything for Jesus. The crowd is also told that if anyone is ashamed of him and his words (He's looking at you, Peter), then the son of man will be ashamed of that person "when he comes in his father's glory with the holy angels." I find it hard to believe that anyone in that day and age could get away with saying something like that in public and not get stoned.
Last, Jesus says that some of those standing there would not taste death before they see the kingdom of god come. Well. They are all dead now, so what is the kingdom of god? Is it the one we read about in Revelation, the one up in the sky that comes down and settles on earth? That hasn't happened yet. It can't be it, can it? The churches of Christ say that the earthly church (true christians) is the kingdom that Jesus was talking about. However, it seems to me that this is a reference to that time when Jesus is supposed to come back in his father's glory. That kingdom was what was supposed to be near. In that case, Jesus was a liar or a lunatic.
Tuesday, December 11, 2018
Resurrection part four.
We are still in 1 Corinthians chapter 15. Verse 29 says, "if there is no resurrection, what will those do who are baptized for the dead? If the dead are not raised at all, why are people baptized for them?" Good question. In fact I've got another question. Why are Mormons the only people I know of who baptize for the dead. Why doesn't all of christendom practice this? It's biblical.
If we move on to verse 35, Paul tells us what resurrection is like. According to him, there are heavenly bodies and earthly bodies. Earthly bodies that die are metaphorically like seeds that are being sown. The body that is sown is perishable, but what rises up after death is imperishable. "It is sown a natural body and raised a spiritual body." Here is Paul's logic for that: Adam was made a living being, then he was given a spirit. That means spiritual stuff comes after natural stuff. Therefore spiritual bodies come after natural bodies. Duh!
Further proof of spiritual bodies, offered by Paul, is this: Adam, who was the first man, came from the earth. All earthly men are like Adam. The second man (Jesus?) came from heaven. All men are going to be like the second man. As usual, no women are mentioned. Further more, Paul says, "Flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of god, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.....we will not all sleep, but we will all be changed in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed." Paul promises the Corinthians immortality. He says nothing here about judgment on that day, or what happens to non-believers.
In Philippians 4:10-11, Paul says he wants to know Christ and the power of his resurrection, so he can also attain resurrection some day. In Hebrews 6, the author says the resurrection of the dead is one of the elementary teachings about Christ, along with repentance, faith, baptism, and eternal judgment." In Hebrews 11:35 tells of those who were tortured for their faith and refused to be released so that they might have a better resurrection. (!!) That is so messed up.
1 Peter chapter one speaks of a hope of an eternal inheritance for the suffering faithful being kept in heaven and the coming salvation of souls in the last times. This hope comes through the resurrection of Jesus. 1 Peter chapter three tells the reader that baptism with water saves people by the resurrection of Jesus.
Finally, we come back to Revelation 20, where we read of a first resurrection of Christian martyrs and a second resurrection of the rest of the dead, from the sea and Hades. Then comes judgment and second death for anyone whose name is not written in the lambs book of life.
Does this give you a sense of why Christians are so keen on martyrdom? It should also show you that these beliefs are what many Christians believe they are living for, an eternal reward of an imperishable body, for the price of faithfullness. Any alternative is unthinkable to so many. It's hard not to feel sorry for them, wasting so much precious time and thought on a delusion.
If we move on to verse 35, Paul tells us what resurrection is like. According to him, there are heavenly bodies and earthly bodies. Earthly bodies that die are metaphorically like seeds that are being sown. The body that is sown is perishable, but what rises up after death is imperishable. "It is sown a natural body and raised a spiritual body." Here is Paul's logic for that: Adam was made a living being, then he was given a spirit. That means spiritual stuff comes after natural stuff. Therefore spiritual bodies come after natural bodies. Duh!
Further proof of spiritual bodies, offered by Paul, is this: Adam, who was the first man, came from the earth. All earthly men are like Adam. The second man (Jesus?) came from heaven. All men are going to be like the second man. As usual, no women are mentioned. Further more, Paul says, "Flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of god, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.....we will not all sleep, but we will all be changed in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed." Paul promises the Corinthians immortality. He says nothing here about judgment on that day, or what happens to non-believers.
In Philippians 4:10-11, Paul says he wants to know Christ and the power of his resurrection, so he can also attain resurrection some day. In Hebrews 6, the author says the resurrection of the dead is one of the elementary teachings about Christ, along with repentance, faith, baptism, and eternal judgment." In Hebrews 11:35 tells of those who were tortured for their faith and refused to be released so that they might have a better resurrection. (!!) That is so messed up.
1 Peter chapter one speaks of a hope of an eternal inheritance for the suffering faithful being kept in heaven and the coming salvation of souls in the last times. This hope comes through the resurrection of Jesus. 1 Peter chapter three tells the reader that baptism with water saves people by the resurrection of Jesus.
Finally, we come back to Revelation 20, where we read of a first resurrection of Christian martyrs and a second resurrection of the rest of the dead, from the sea and Hades. Then comes judgment and second death for anyone whose name is not written in the lambs book of life.
Does this give you a sense of why Christians are so keen on martyrdom? It should also show you that these beliefs are what many Christians believe they are living for, an eternal reward of an imperishable body, for the price of faithfullness. Any alternative is unthinkable to so many. It's hard not to feel sorry for them, wasting so much precious time and thought on a delusion.
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